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Couture's BlackBelt  

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Harpo
Estimable Member

If anyone else was a bit confused about the Black Belt that was draped over Couture's shoulders tonight, that was his Catch Wrestling coach, Neil Melanson. Apparently wrestling has belts or am I missing information on Melanson?

http://www.xtremecouture.tv/Instructors/Trainer_NeilMelanson.htm

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Posted : 29/08/2010 1:13 am
Harpo
Estimable Member

Right here he says he's not a BJJ guy.........

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Posted : 29/08/2010 1:20 am
gspmmafan
Reputable Member

So if I submit my 12 yr old niece with an arm triangle can I get a black belt? What about a really old out of shape white belt? Does something like this qualify me for a black belt? :crazy:

Edit: also no disrespect to Randy I like him a lot but that was really weird when he got that.

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Posted : 29/08/2010 1:30 am
SamHade
Honorable Member

Strange. Latest trend. Giving black belts to guys who don't train with a gi. No disrespect to Randy--he could kick my a*s in his sleep. But why give a BB to a guy who will never wear/train with it? Too many folks are going to assume that it is a legit BJJ BB. The more this happens, the more it waters down our sport.

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Posted : 29/08/2010 2:48 am




kuangren
Noble Member

it's not a BJJ black belt, it's a black belt in Neil Melanson's personal style of catch wrestling. Kind of silly IMO.

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Posted : 29/08/2010 2:53 am
Harpo
Estimable Member

Melanson makes it pretty clear that it's not BJJ.

I think it's funny that the uninformed Media has no clue and instantly starts reporting the blackbelt as being BJJ. I myself was a bit confused and would likely have assumed the same had I not turned to Google and Youtube.

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Posted : 29/08/2010 11:03 am
maverickcop
Honorable Member

...and YOU get a humpback whale.... and YOU get a humpback whale.... and YOOOUUU get a black belt.... EVERYONE gets black belts!!! :rofl:

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Posted : 29/08/2010 11:30 am
Harpo
Estimable Member

In my opinion, if Melanson and Couture wanted to create a ranking system that is unique the the training style that they've developing / are developing, they should have created a show of rank that is just as unique as their art. A belt is for a Gi. They could have done unique shorts, ankle bands, patches, anything.

Problem is this:

The colored belt system is just SO caramelized into American views on Martial Arts that having anything else to show rank would have required so much "selling" to the public. Using a belt is full circle marketing. A colored belt has so much appeal in our culture based on its familiarity that it simply required if you are trying to expand a customer base and establish yourself as legitimate.

I would have had a TON of respect had they kept a folk level or grassroots approach and made a show of rank that is unique.... beat their own path...... "Screw the norm. This is ours and we'll do it our way"........

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Posted : 29/08/2010 12:16 pm




jandaim
Trusted Member

Too many folks are going to assume that it is a legit BJJ BB. The more this happens, the more it waters down our sport.

I don't think it counts as "watering down our sport" when an accomplished grappler like Randy Couture is misperceived as having a BJJ BB. Actually I think it might do the opposite, lending credibility.

It's not like BJJ grappling is so vastly different from other "types" of grappling that a guy like Randy, Matt Hughes, etc couldn't easily have "blackbelt skill" if they donned a gi for a couple of months.

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Posted : 29/08/2010 1:41 pm
Capps
Eminent Member

Randy did well against Souza from what I saw of their xmission grappling match. As long as they are honest about what system they are trying to promote, I don't see the problem.

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Posted : 29/08/2010 2:10 pm
rdc569
Reputable Member

Whatever they call it, it's grappling. They want to rank their students to reward them. That is great. Also, I see why they chose the traditional BJJ ranks... they take a ton of shit from BJJ. Melansan trained under Parisyan too, didn't he?

Could you imagine what the old school Judo guys were saying when the IBJJF adopted the Judo type belt rankings that replaced the old school white/blue/navy blue belt system? It probably sounded a ton like the grumblings on here.

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Posted : 29/08/2010 3:57 pm
Harpo
Estimable Member

Melansan trained under Parisyan too, didn't he?

Yes.

And I agree with what you are saying. It's their art that they are organizing/developing. They can do what they want with it. I get why they are using belts to show rank. As I said, I would have loved to see another method used to show rank, but if they want to use belts, so be it and I wish them well. As long as it's a legit art that's functional in the real world, peace to 'em.

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Posted : 29/08/2010 4:35 pm




Illustrious Member Admin

They just need to get consistent. If they say they are not jiu jitsu and these are not jiu jitsu belts, then stop using the words on the website


Our members here at Xtreme Couture know our head Jits guy (Neil Melanson) as a coach who knows the science of Jiu Jitsu.

Melanson dedicates his time to his students and constantly works on perfecting his teaching skills. Instead of simply focusing on how techniques are done, he also teaches why they work and how they fit into the bigger picture.

PUBLIC CLASSES TAUGHT:
• Jiu-Jitsu (Beginner , Intermediate, Advanced)
• Private Lessons

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Posted : 29/08/2010 7:04 pm
Harpo
Estimable Member

They just need to get consistent. If they say they are not jiu jitsu and these are not jiu jitsu belts, then stop using the words on the website


Our members here at Xtreme Couture know our head Jits guy (Neil Melanson) as a coach who knows the science of Jiu Jitsu.

Melanson dedicates his time to his students and constantly works on perfecting his teaching skills. Instead of simply focusing on how techniques are done, he also teaches why they work and how they fit into the bigger picture.

PUBLIC CLASSES TAUGHT:
• Jiu-Jitsu (Beginner , Intermediate, Advanced)
• Private Lessons

Great observation.

Melanson clearly has jiu jitsu experience but he expresses in interviews the fact that his system is a hybrid (hell, in that one video he says flat out that he's NOT a bjj guy and that he's a catch wrestler....). My gut feeling is that his jiu jitsu classes are indeed the hybrid method that he developed. The title of Jiu Jitsu sounds a lot sexier than a title of Catch Wrestling. Of course we can only speculate without experiencing it for ourselves, but do you think they are using BJJ as a title while teaching their all encompassing hybrid? The average Joe Schmoe looking to do a Martial Art will pick Jiu Jitsu over Wrestling 8 times out of 10 based simply on the name...

This is a little off topic, but it relates.... I like the way Jake Shields did it with the hybrid style that he's developed and marketed. Shields came from a strong wrestling background before linking up with Cesar Gracie. Of course Shields eventually earned his Black Belt under Gracie (one of only 3 Black Belts handed out by C. Gracie if I'm not mistaken). Long story short, Shields went on to develop a more aggressive method of Jiu Jitsu that combined many aspects of his former wrestling days. He named his method American Jiu Jitsu and started to develop his approach based on his own theories for fighting, self defense, etc.

My point in bringing up Shields' "American Jiu Jitsu" is that it has grown in a similar fashion to Melanson's method. Melanson has multiple backgrounds and has seemed to combine them into it's own creature. It has proven to be successful..... Randy is still whipping ass at 47 and we all saw what Chael Sonnen did against Anderson Silva (Chael spent time training with Melanson and Couture for that fight). With the fact that Melanson's method was developed in house with Randy The Natural Couture, it seems to me that the marketing power to draw in students is limited only by those who want to promote this system as a martial art worth studying.

With a man like Couture being a believer and promoter of the system, why not coin your own name and roll with it?

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Posted : 29/08/2010 11:06 pm
rdc569
Reputable Member

The title of Jiu Jitsu sounds a lot sexier than a title of Catch Wrestling. Of course we can only speculate without experiencing it for ourselves, but do you think they are using BJJ as a title while teaching their all encompassing hybrid? The average Joe Schmoe looking to do a Martial Art will pick Jiu Jitsu over Wrestling 8 times out of 10 based simply on the name...

That sounds like something a BJJ guy would say. I don't know if most people know what Jiu Jitsu is though.

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Posted : 30/08/2010 12:33 am
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